Post by steevodeevo on Aug 24, 2008 21:54:58 GMT
The forums are pretty doom and gloom about PvP balance, fun, interaction, commerce, RvR - the works basically. It seems (as to be fair is often the case on forums) that no one is happy about much and one group or another is turned off by FL's constant frantic tweaking of the game system to get it balanced and worthy.
But does anyone have a killer idea to resolve? No. One idea always breaks another system. Why? Well, having watched this game since 2003 I think I am at least qualified to toss in an idea as to why it can't be fixed in its current state (IMO). So I did toss im my two peneth worth and posted the following on the forum.
www.burningsea.com/forums/showthread.php?p=494591#post494591
I am interested to know if anyone at all from TLC agrees with me or indeed doesn't
To save linking to thread and my post above (unless you want to read the flames I may or may not get back or the rest of the thread), transcript of my post below:
Quote from GB earlier in thread:
Play to crush ganking RvR games only work when the map areas are large enough to separate players styles or everyone is on one massive 3D server like EvE.
PVE players & those that enjoy balanced PvP or peaceful economic gameplay will not find a longterm home in Potbs in the forseeable future.
That kinda hits the nail on the head for me having undertaken a marathon read of this thread.
I think the game design went hugely wrong very early in development when they set the scale of the OS map. Watching this game from pre-release back in 2003, the biggest dissapointment I encountered was when I realised what the map scale was going to be. The fact that you are in a small fishbowl does not allow for any separation of styles, RvR, true ambush play, economics, politics or drama and tension from running freight with a % chance of being ambushed en route.
The map scale is simply way too small to balance all of these mechanics as debated at length and with passion on this forum. The map is so 'zoomed in' that any small tweak simply unballances something else.
I remember some debate early on in pre-beta discussions about this issue but few seemed to have the sense of doom I felt when I saw we had a 20 minute paddle from East to West of the entire map and 4 mins from Gulf of Mexico to Eastern Florida. I recall the reasons given for the map scale were down to 'reducing travel boredom' and 'keeping up levels of fun' which dismayed me at the time.
If due to larger map scale I have to work primarily at sub-map or 'Regional' level as it takes several hours to cross the entire map then so be it. Think of the player created factional play and zonal politics this would create. Think of the rich commerce opportunities transporting regional rare trade goods (ironwood, zinc, etc) and the consequent opportunities for real pirate ambushes on the OS. A true meta game.
If you don't like sitting in a cove on the OS waiting for a passing freighter in a trade lane as a Pirate, then you could still join the Navies and hang out at high population ports for RvR or go in hard in Groups for spectacular battles agaionst Navy Patrols - there would still be plenty of interaction, and there are always options for interaction such as duels, fleet battles etc.
I think the devs may be flogging a dead horse tweaking this and that in the current fishbowl. Redesign the OS, zoom out the map and plan a series of patches up to version 3.0 to handle the scale changes and new options and problems this brings. Then I will certainly stick with it through thick and thin. The game would be revolutionary and what at heart many of us dreamed and hoped it would be.
But does anyone have a killer idea to resolve? No. One idea always breaks another system. Why? Well, having watched this game since 2003 I think I am at least qualified to toss in an idea as to why it can't be fixed in its current state (IMO). So I did toss im my two peneth worth and posted the following on the forum.
www.burningsea.com/forums/showthread.php?p=494591#post494591
I am interested to know if anyone at all from TLC agrees with me or indeed doesn't
To save linking to thread and my post above (unless you want to read the flames I may or may not get back or the rest of the thread), transcript of my post below:
Quote from GB earlier in thread:
Play to crush ganking RvR games only work when the map areas are large enough to separate players styles or everyone is on one massive 3D server like EvE.
PVE players & those that enjoy balanced PvP or peaceful economic gameplay will not find a longterm home in Potbs in the forseeable future.
That kinda hits the nail on the head for me having undertaken a marathon read of this thread.
I think the game design went hugely wrong very early in development when they set the scale of the OS map. Watching this game from pre-release back in 2003, the biggest dissapointment I encountered was when I realised what the map scale was going to be. The fact that you are in a small fishbowl does not allow for any separation of styles, RvR, true ambush play, economics, politics or drama and tension from running freight with a % chance of being ambushed en route.
The map scale is simply way too small to balance all of these mechanics as debated at length and with passion on this forum. The map is so 'zoomed in' that any small tweak simply unballances something else.
I remember some debate early on in pre-beta discussions about this issue but few seemed to have the sense of doom I felt when I saw we had a 20 minute paddle from East to West of the entire map and 4 mins from Gulf of Mexico to Eastern Florida. I recall the reasons given for the map scale were down to 'reducing travel boredom' and 'keeping up levels of fun' which dismayed me at the time.
If due to larger map scale I have to work primarily at sub-map or 'Regional' level as it takes several hours to cross the entire map then so be it. Think of the player created factional play and zonal politics this would create. Think of the rich commerce opportunities transporting regional rare trade goods (ironwood, zinc, etc) and the consequent opportunities for real pirate ambushes on the OS. A true meta game.
If you don't like sitting in a cove on the OS waiting for a passing freighter in a trade lane as a Pirate, then you could still join the Navies and hang out at high population ports for RvR or go in hard in Groups for spectacular battles agaionst Navy Patrols - there would still be plenty of interaction, and there are always options for interaction such as duels, fleet battles etc.
I think the devs may be flogging a dead horse tweaking this and that in the current fishbowl. Redesign the OS, zoom out the map and plan a series of patches up to version 3.0 to handle the scale changes and new options and problems this brings. Then I will certainly stick with it through thick and thin. The game would be revolutionary and what at heart many of us dreamed and hoped it would be.